Chapter 02 - A Rambling Review of Series 12, Part 2

From Episode 2: The End of the Fucking World

JB: I think we’re going to go ahead and talk about the last episode first because it’s gotten the most butt-hurt fanwankery on YouTube and Twitter.

CHRIS: You guy’s aren’t real upset about it, are ya?

JB: I am not … upset. I’m not incensed. I’m not saying Doctor Who is dead or they fucked Doctor Who. BUT, I just have to wonder why Chibnall did what he did.

SEAN: I’m on the same boat. I watched this twice and fell asleep both times watching it. Every show-runner from RTD to Moffat to Chibnall have all done this - where they created an extra Doctor. It worked the best when Moffat did it. Believe it or not, it’s the one thing he did I fricking love. He did the War Doctor, and RTD did phony, dorky clone Doctor, and now this. I don’t mind it. I think it’s kinda cool, but it didn’t fit into the episode that it was in because we had this whole other story about the Master and the Cybermen. I don’t know what the fuck happened near the end of this episode or how it was resolved. I think the Doctor just “thought” it all away. Rewriting the Doctor’s past? I think it’s pretty interesting, but it seemed a little misplaced.

JB: What are they going to do with this? I imagine they’re going to explore it more in the next season because there’s still a lot of unanswered questions. A lot of people are accusing Chibnall of pushing the “feminist agenda”, and I do have to agree with that. I don’t mind that he’s doing it. Every show runner had an agenda to push. For RTD it was the “gay agenda”. For Moffat it was … I dunno, the “Scottish agenda”?

CHRIS: The self aggrandizing agenda.

JB: But Chibnall is on a mission. We have this uncredited woman, a Shobogan, who is basically the founder of Time Lord society because she found this “timeless child” in a gateway somewhere, discovered that she can regenerate, and decided to take advantage of that. She experimented on the child, tried the results of her experiments on herself so she can regenerate, and then all of the sudden we see this Time Lord walking down a corridor. The implication is that all these white guys took all the credit for founding the Time Lord society and wrote this woman out of history.

SEAN: I didn’t perceive that.

CHRIS: I didn’t get that either.

SEAN: Because when she tries the serum to try to make herself regenerate, she turns into a man who we see again later in the Panopticon robes joining the others. It’s almost like they were in a secret society.

CHRIS: What confused me is … shit, what’s her name?

SEAN: She’s got a cool name. Tacton or something like that.

CHRIS: Is she Rassilon?

JB: I want to say no. This Tacturn person discovered regeneration.

CHRIS: But previously Rassilon was given credit for that.

JB: Was he? I thought he was just credited for working with Omega to capture the black hole which became the power source for time travel.

CHRIS: I’m blanking on where he’s credited with regeneration. Probably in a novel, but it has been suggested that Rassilon developed regeneration. They even call it “The Rassilon Imperative”, which is what they put into Time Lords when they graduate from the Academy. I feel like it’s one or two things. Either she is actually Rassilon or when Rassilon took power he stole her story.

JB: I think it’s the second scenario. Why would she change her name to Rassilon?

SEAN: What you’re getting is from the books. NOT CANNON! FAKE NEWS!

CHRIS: I dispute that, sir!

SEAN: I read something wonderful. A fan theory from some podcast that the child was actually Susan and Tacton was the Doctor.

CHRIS: That’s a fucking twist!

SEAN: That actually would’ve made it better!

JB: Here we go! We’re rewriting the story and making it better.

CHRIS: I’m going to offer this in defense of Chibnall doing this. During the previous era, I don’t know if it’s much about how Moffat pretty much blew the mystery of the Doctor, but he flogged it so fucking hard. “Doctor Who?” “What’s his name?” All that shit. The Hybrid bullshit. It was all pushed to a point where something needed to be changed. With this, it expands shit massively. It had gotten down to the only mystery of the Doctor was what was his name or what’s he hiding, but now there’s so much fucking more to the Doctor than we knew. More that the Doctor even knows. Here we are speculating about it and trying to piece it together and coming up with our own fucking theories. I LIKE that! I’ve MISSED that!

SEAN: Good point, but it didn’t make watching the episode any better.

JB: I think it’s a good idea to reestablish the mystery of the Doctor. Let’s just have her be this mysterious person traveling in a Police Box and righting wrongs. That’s fine. There might have been a better way of doing it. “There should’ve been another way!” There are some who are saying this is Chibnall’s way of explaining “the Morbius Doctors”, which for years I thought didn’t need explaining at all.

CHRIS: Same.

JB: I just accepted those as past incarnations of Morbius.

SEAN: Me too!

CHRIS: You know what this means now? Phillip Hinchcliffe was a fucking Doctor!

JB: and Terrence Dicks and Douglas Camfield, and I think Graeme Harper?

CHRIS: They’re all Doctors now. That’s actually kinda cool. You can make the argument that they’re Doctors now.

JB: It was implied when she was flashing back to all of her earlier incarnations.

CHRIS: Yeah, the Morbius scene was in there.

JB: We still don’t know what the deal is with Ruth. Why does her TARDIS look like a Police Box?

SEAN: She’s pre-Hartnell.

JB: Is she, though?

SEAN: Yeah.

CHRIS: She can’t be if her TARDIS is a Police Box! The TARDIS became a Police Box in “An Unearthly Child”. That’s when it got stuck. When they go back to 10,000 BC or whenever, he gets out of the TARDIS and goes, “Huh. That’s weird. It’s still a Police Box.” That was when the change occurred.

JB: Unless they actually took the Doctor’s memory, planted a false memory so that he felt he had to leave Gallifrey and take Susan with him. She may not even be his granddaughter. They planted a false memory of his past, sent him directly to Earth in the Police Box. So all the stuff about “Quinnis” and all the adventures he and Susan had before meeting Ian and Barbara were all lies. So it’s right before the beginning of “An Unearthly Child” when … what are they called? It’s not the CIA. They call themselves something else.

CHRIS: The Division.

JB: So the Division planted them on Earth, and he’s been an agent for them all along. And the CIA is all a cover story.

CHRIS: (laughs) See, I love this!

JB: But it’s NOT going to be that! It’s going to be something stupid at the end.

SEAN: I don’t think it’s going to be anything. Maybe they’re touch on it a couple of times. Maybe Ruth will come back.

JB: Yeah, because at the end, the Doctor gets captured by the Judoon.

SEAN: Oh, yeah. God, that was so dumb.

CHRIS: Oh, so the Judoon just teleport into the TARDIS and snatch the Doctor?! FUCK, really?! It’s that fucking easy?! Oh, the hordes of Ghengus Khan tried to battle this down, but the Judoon can just come right in and arrest your ass! FUCK! I’m going on a tangent here, but I do love how the history and the mystery of the Doctor has been expanded. I’m sure all of us have delved so far into this shit that you’d run into someone who’s less well-versed in Doctor Who, and they’d be like, “I have this theory” or “I think this”, or “I’ve always wondered this about the Doctor”, and you probably have an answer, either from the show or the novels or whatever. We can give a good explanation or at least a hypothesis, but now my wife will ask me, “Does this mean the Doctor is blah blah blah?” And I’m like (gleefully) “I don’t fucking know!” I like the fact that I’m back to I don’t fucking know and I have to figure it out again.

SEAN: I like talking about it like we are right now and maybe thinking about it, but what worries me is that I have absolutely no trust that the show will wrap it up for me in a nice, neat bow that’s going to make me happy.

CHRIS: I think Moffat has jaded you a bit. He’s jaded us all. You’re waiting for all of this to be explained away with a fucking handwave and a throwaway line. I don’t think Chibnall’s going to do that. I’ll be really mad if he does.

JB: Right, but what if the next show-runner says this is all bullshit and this actually didn’t happen?

CHRIS: Chibnall is still on for at least one more series, right?

JB: Yeah, he and Jodie are around for one more season.

SEAN: Which we’ll have to wait another year for.

JB: Yeah, it’ll be Fall 2021 before we see that.

CHRIS: Fuck, we might all be dead by then.

SEAN: I know! Coronavirus! I’ve heard two of us cough since the beginning of this podcast. It’s okay, I’ve got bourbon, and that kills the germs. I’ve got a question, because there’s something that didn’t sit right with this episode, and that was the Master’s plan. I’m not exactly sure what he intended to do other than use the Cybermen and the Matrix to destroy everything? All organic matter? Destroy the Doctor?

CHRIS: That was the particle that was going to do that.

SEAN: Okay, the particle that was inside the Cyberman. I can’t remember his name.

CHRIS: That was going to destroy all organic matter.

SEAN: So that’s what the Master wanted to do. Why? What’s the deal with the Master? Why is he so fucking bitter?

CHRIS: That’s the eternal question with him, though.

JB: This is the third series finale in four years where we had the Master pitching in with the Cybermen. THE THIRD ONE! You just basically described “Death in Heaven”!

SEAN: Oh, my god, I hated that episode!


JB: And this story was just as bad as “Death in Heaven”, only it was done much better.

CHRIS: No, I’m not agreeing with that!

SEAN: No, me neither.

CHRIS: I will buy that the story has some severe similarities, but I enjoyed this way more.

JB: We have a callback to the moment where the Doctor is about to destroy Gallifrey for good, and we have the Master goading her! “Go on! Kill me! You know you can’t!” We even had that old guy, whats-his-fuck, who was the keeper of the portal! That should’ve been the Brigadier!

CHRIS: Very Brigadier-esque, yes.

SEAN: That’s a good point.

CHRIS: I want JB for the next show-runner.

JB (laughs) That’s the problem I have! They just keep going to the well! Time and time again! What’s the use of making the Doctor’s history unknown when you’re going to tell the same stories over and over?

CHRIS: It hasn’t been resolved yet.

JB: We’re going to get the Daleks again! On Christmas or New Years!

SEAN: I just want to point out that the idea of being trapped on a huge ship populated with dormant Cybermen, and the companions’ plan to disguise themselves as Cybermen is kind of a cool idea. But it’s really not that easy to take a Cyberman apart and put yourself in the Cyberman outfit. What are you going to do with all the gross bits that you took out?

CHRIS: They glossed that over! I can’t picture Graham having the fortitude for gutting a Cyberman. Yaz? Maybe.

JB: We saw that before in “Attack of the Cybermen”.

SEAN: It reminds me of the scene in “Star Trek: First Contact” where Patrick Stewart and the lady kill a Borg and he’s tearing the Borg apart, and he’s like, “Oh, this was Ensign whoever.” It wasn’t really graphic, but they should’ve had some of that in this episode.

CHRIS: I’ve not seen this movie, but I can picture “oh this is Ensign Smith. I can tell from the viscosity.”

SEAN: No, the name tag was still on. It’s a damn good movie. I’m not a Star Trek nerd, but it’s a pretty good movie.

CHRIS: I’ll be in quarantine soon, so yeah I’ll have to check it out.

JB: I’ve been watching “Star Trek: Picard”. It gets violent!

CHRIS: I watched the first episode, and I fucking loved it. I want to watch more of it. I haven’t had the chance to, but yeah, it’s good.

JB: Regarding the companions, I think when you separate them from the Doctor, it is interesting to watch. They work very well, but when it’s all four of them, it just doesn’t work. They hold the Doctor back. And really the Doctor didn’t have fuck-all to do in this episode. She was helpless most of the time. She was being told “this happened, and then this happened, and this happened, and blah blah blah, and YOU’RE THE TIMELESS CHILD!” They can easily retcon all of this by saying the Master was lying. He was playing some kind of mind game with her. If they really want to write that out, they can do it like that. But anyway, there’s just too many damn companions, however Ryan and Graham will be leaving after this Dalek episode.

CHRIS: You know what’s going to happen, right?

JB: Yeah, we’re going to get “Thasmine!”

CHRIS: The last time they had the packed TARDIS, they had to kill one.

JB: Oh, you think Graham is going to buy it?

CHRIS: I don’t know if it’ll be Graham. Thematically it would probably make the most sense. Let’s face it - Chibnall’s probably itching to kill off an old white dude.

JB: (laughs)

SEAN: In real life?

JB: (laughs harder)

CHRIS: Draw your own conclusions, kids. The last time they had the big Romper Room TARDIS with the huge crew, we all know how Adric ended. It would be such a missed opportunity if they’re going to reduce the size of this “awesome” family bond that this crew has, the most emotionally devastating thing they can do to be to kill one of them. If the problem is the TARDIS crew is too big, before when you kill off a companion you almost immediately have to replace them, but if you got all these superfluous companions, you can kill one. Narratively speaking, you’re not obligated to replace him.

SEAN: I could foresee them killing off Ryan, and then Graham does a Tegan and says “I can’t take this anymore! Drop me off!” Or if they kill Graham, Ryan would want to go off with Captain Jack, because we haven’t gotten an explanation of Captain Jack’s involvement in all this and how he knew about the lone Cyberman.

CHRIS: But he said he’d be back.

SEAN: That means we have two females in the TARDIS, which is a first. So I think we would need to have a HOT male companion to join as well.

CHRIS: We might as well get it over with, yeah. It’s only fair. Speaking as a straight guy, we’ve had 50+ years of male Doctor and hot female companion. It’s only fair to turn the tables.

SEAN: Iris Wildtyme had her hot male companion in the books, although THAT’S NOT CANON! IT’S FAKE NEWS! Wait, was he hot? I remember he was gay. Oh, man, imagine if they brought Iris Wildtyme to the TV series!

CHRIS: That would be great! Especially if they had Katy Manning playing her.

SEAN: I know!

JB: Yeah, she would have to.

SEAN: That is a great character!

CHRIS: Anything that brings back Katy Manning to the show I am completely fucking on board with.

JB: She’s all over Twitter. Every time I log on to Twitter she’s got 1000 tweets on there. I can see her as Wildtyme going, “River who?”

SEAN: So can we talk about the other episodes now?

JB: Yeah. Why not?


SEAN: (laughs) Alright, I think I almost love “The Haunting of Blah Blah Blah”.

CHRIS: Although that completely blows up some Big Finish continuity!


CHRIS: The Mary Shelly shit was really good on the Eighth Doctor audios!


CHRIS: I have accepted that this is Doctor Who and bullshit can exist in simultaneous spaces at the same fucking time. The conservation of bullshit rule does not fucking apply in the Doctor Who universe. I’m okay with that, but I was a little disappointed watching the episode. Aw, poor Mary Shelly, you don’t get to be a companion.

JB: Not yet.

SEAN: Wait a minute. I don’t know because I’m not indoctrinated. What happens in Big Finish with Mary Shelly?

CHRIS: She was a companion for three or four episodes.

SEAN: Really?! That’s very interesting.

CHRIS: On the very same night that this episode covers, the Eighth Doctor shows up, and he’s all fucked up. The audio story also gets very timey-wimey. It’s a future incarnation of him that’s all fucked up and kind of Frankenstein-ish shows up and scares the shit out of them. And then later the more normalized but past version of the Eighth Doctor shows up, and a very Frankenstein-ish adventure ensues. And at the end of it Mary Shelly takes off with the Doctor. They have four adventures before she’s dropped off back in her timeline, and she starts writing all these crazy fucking horror stories based on the shit that happened to her in the TARDIS. All of those stories are pretty solid. There’s a really good one with the Cybermen set in Elizabethan England. So the continuities are really fucking each other hard now.

SEAN: I am tempted to say FAKE NEWS! HASHTAG SAD! But, “Night of the Doctor” has proved to us that Big Finish is canon.

JB: I think it’s an alternate timeline that was changed, whether it was after “The Big Bang” or whatever. They do it a lot on “The Flash”. I thought the half-man, half-Cyberman was just to tie it into “Frankenstein”. My girlfriend was watching it with me, and she said, “Hang on! Wait a minute! I thought they just took their brains and plopped them into the cyber suit! Why is he still, like, a man?” And I said, “Well, if you’d watch the classic series with me, you would know! But noooo! You won’t watch the classic series with me! You think it’s all horseshit!”

SEAN: Wait a minute! Back up, because I have seen all the classic episodes, and I don’t know why he’s like that. Why is he like that?

JB: Just the fact that it’s still a person in the cyber suit.

CHRIS: And they establish in the penultimate episode that, they don’t go into details, but…

JB: He was a mistake.

CHRIS: He was unfinished or he was faulty or something.

SEAN: Well then, why does he get to be the leader?

CHRIS: Because he still has emotions, and emotions are power!

SEAN: Oh, and he has the thing planted in his chest.

CHRIS: And he’s got a thing that can destroy all organic shit!

JB: Just like Sarah-Jane Smith did in “Journey’s End”!


JB: Oh, my god! You know what? He re-wrote fucking “Cyberwoman”!

SEAN: I’m just trying to wrap my head around this.

CHRIS: You gotta give Chibnall credit for this - like especially for the Cybermen, they have, over the course of RTD and Moffat, became very cartoonish.

JB: Yeah.

CHRIS: They’re fucking terrifying again. They have a sinister quality to them once again. Chibnall really likes to take people out of their comfort zone. I thinks that what Doctor Who needed at this point.

SEAN: Did he write the New Years Day Dalek episode?

JB: Yes, he did.

SEAN: That was the first time in a long time that I thought Daleks are scary. Because that fucking Dalek was killing people!

CHRIS: That girl walking around with it on her back being all zombified? And the Dalek voice coming out of her? That was legit fucking cringey. I loved it!

JB: What I really liked about that episode was the Dalek laugh. The Dalek was actually laughing, and everyone was all “Daleks don’t laugh!” They do have emotions. Everyone keeps confusing the Daleks with the Borg or the Cybermen. The Daleks are very emotional. I mean they’re full of hate and bile.

CHRIS: It’s all negative emotions, but yes.

JB: And I thought that was brilliant! It was an extra-dimension that we never really got before.

SEAN: That was a great episode, but that was over a year ago. What was the episode with the birds called?

JB: Oh, god, I dunno. I just have that one down on my notes as “The Bird Flu one”.

CHRIS: I have it as “Birds and Plastic and Shit.”

SEAN: Somebody on Twitter posted a picture of an action figure for the birds! And that’s what it was! (laughs)

CHRIS: I feel like I’ve been the Chibnall apologist for this podcast, but the fucking bird episode was bullshit!

JB: I thought it was alright. I think that’s the story where the companions worked best as a “fam”. They came in and each had their own jobs to do. They were already on the case when the episode began. Kinda like a Seventh Doctor and Ace story when we join them already in progress. I didn’t mind it at all. It was a roller coaster ride of an episode. At the end it got a bit too much THIS IS THE MESSAGE, PEOPLE! But it wasn’t as bad as “Orphan 55”. I wasn’t really bothered by it, but it’s like “one and done” and I’ve already forgotten about it.

SEAN: I’m with you, JB. I really enjoyed it as well. I like that there were hot lesbians in it. I mean they were lesbians, weren’t they? Please tell me they were lesbians.

CHRIS: Who were?

SEAN: The girls that were doing the travel blog. The VLOG! And the one girls goes, “Oh, this is beautiful! You have to see it!” And when they get there it’s a garbage dump. And so instead of turning around and walking back 20 feet and camping there, they decide to camp right there in the garbage dump. And then one of them gets killed the next day.

JB: Wow, that sounds just like “Arc of Infinity”.

SEAN: (laughs)

CHRIS: Fuck! It does!

SEAN: I totally … those two guys … I’m serious!


SEAN: That was JN-T, and he knew what he was doing! Lets go camping in this fucking sewer in the middle of … where was that? Amsterdam?

JB: Yes.

SEAN: Let’s go there. There’s hostels where we can spend five bucks and spend the whole night. But no, let’s have our little slumber party in a sewer.

JB: “At least take your shoes off, for crying out loud!”

SEAN: Oh, that’s brilliant! I love that! That’s excellent!

CHRIS: I hadn’t even thought about that, but yeah, it’s there.

JB: Doctor Who’s Greatest Hits.

SEAN: I’m going to say it right now, and I don’t want anyone to come at me for lack of a better word.

CHRIS: Don’t at me, bro!

SEAN: This episode had inclusiveness plastered all over it.

CHRIS: It did. It really did.

JB: You had the gay astronaut. Of course.

CHRIS: Everybody was gay! Everybody!

SEAN: Well, gay and/or black and … the Asian girl turned out the be the villain. That might be a little racist in these Coronavirus times.

JB: And they did kill off the black guy.

CHRIS: And, to be fair, when they made that episode, Coronavirus wasn’t even a thing.


SEAN: We’ll have to wait till 2021 for that!

CHRIS: It couldn’t be because the Coronavirus got here in a Police Box TARDIS … nah, just kidding. Sorry.

JB: Yeah. “Praxeus”! It was called “Praxeus”. That’s actually a Klingon moon in Star Trek 6! That was the moon that exploded

CHRIS: It’s also a Latin compound word for plastic and ass.

SEAN: I was going to say it sounds like a pharmaceutical company. What other episodes were there?

CHRIS: Oh, I want to talk about the Eternal fingering people in the ear.


JB: That should’ve been a two-parter! We actually watched that episode on the laptop while vacationing in Hawaii.

CHRIS: That was “Can You See Me?” or…

JB: “Can You Hear Me?” That could’ve been a classic episode, but it needed to be a two-parter.

SEAN: I agree a hundred percent!

CHRIS: Yeah, there was too much going on for one fucking episode.

JB: And I’ll even say … even though I’ve been bitching about them playing the greatest hits, those two characters should’ve been the Black Guardian and the White Guardian.

CHRIS: I actually thought that’s where they were going. It doesn’t really exclude that possibility.

JB: They referred to them in the third person. And they also referred to The Celestial Toymaker, but they’re Eternals. They’re the same race from “Enlightenment”.

SEAN: With better costumes. It was a really great callback, but it was great for people who didn’t know anything about “Enlightenment”. And it was really well done. These two characters reminded me, especially the guy, of “Hellraiser”. The cenobites? Do you know what I’m talking about?

JB: No, I don’t watch horror movies.

CHRIS: Same.

SEAN: And if you had told me there’s this scene where an alien appears in this guy’s bedroom, and all of his fingers come off and one of them goes in the guy’s ear, I would’ve said that’s the stupidest thing I’ve ever heard. That’s not a Doctor Who script! Chuck that away! But no, they pulled it off! They pulled it off very well! There was the theme about mental illness with Ryan’s friend, who I thought was his brother.

JB: I didn’t pick that up at all! I just thought that he was just like “oh I’ve been seeing things at night and please stay with me cause I’m really creeped out.” I didn’t get at all until after the fact that the guy was suffering from depression.

CHRIS: I thought it was pretty obvious they were playing on his depression. I didn’t catch that he was his brother. I thought it was just a friend of his, but…

JB: That was his brother?!

SEAN: No, no. It was a friend, but I thought it was his brother. Maybe that’s just a white racist thing. I dunno.

CHRIS: I’m not sure if you’re right or wrong, honestly. But I did catch that he had some mental health issues, or maybe emotional issues would be a better way to put it.

SEAN: Because of the state of his apartment. Mentally ill people don’t often the wherewithal or the energy to wash dishes or whatever. You’d be like “how can you fucking live in that”, but for them it’s an everyday thing.

CHRIS: I am so glad I turned my camera off.

JB: They had that PSA at the end of the episode, and I thought it was in reference to the Doctor being socially awkward. We have the scene where Graham is sharing with the Doctor his fears of his cancer coming back. And she’s like, “Oh, I’m, uh, socially awkward, and I really don’t know what to say now, so I’m going to just fiddle with the console.” There were all these fans that were so incensed about that! And they actually wrote to the BBC, and the BBC felt the need to respond. And I’m like “have you been watching this fucking show?!” This is Doctor Who.

CHRIS: She wasn’t dismissive. She just didn’t know what to do. I’ve almost been in that exact situation she was in. I had a very dear friend of mine who was dying of colon cancer. He was in the position Graham was in except he wasn’t in remission. He way dying. I knew it, and he knew it. “I’m going to die.” And I was kinda in the Doctor’s shoes. I mean what do you say to that? You don’t come back with, “Oh, no you’re not.” Cause yeah, he’s going to. We all fucking know that.

JB: I faced that twice. Once with my mom, and once with my ex-bandmate.

SEAN: I remember watching the episode, and what she initially said, I actually said out loud, “What a bitch!” But then she followed it through with “I’m going to fidget with the TARDIS console until I think of something better to say.”

CHRIS: I think it was accurately depicted because it was really awkward.

SEAN: That’s how it is.

JB: I’m going to go the extra-dimension here, because it’s like, “I’m the Doctor. I’ve got a universe to save. I got a problem to figure out. I don’t have the room … I don’t have the space mentally or emotionally to deal with this.” In “Pyramid of Mars” Sarah-Jane berated the Doctor about how four people had died, and the Doctor is like, “I’ve got a universe to save! I don’t have time to deal with this right now!”

SEAN: That’s correct. And that would also be correct with the Capaldi Doctor. But not Jodie.

JB: I think with regards to Jodie’s Doctor, the cracks are starting to form. She started with being this all-inclusive Doctor, and I see her going “I can’t keep up with this anymore! I don’t even know where I’m coming from anymore! It’s getting really dangerous now. Why do I still have these people traveling in my TARDIS?”

CHRIS: That was evident in the beginning of the last episode. They’re all starting to set up their little gadgets to fight the Cybermen, and it all goes tits up. And she’s like, “No, you guys need to fuck off because you’re all human. And you’re not going to die - you’re going to end up as fucking Cybermen. And that’s going to be my fault. So fuck off!” She’ pushing them away really fucking fast. You’re absolutely right. She’s cracking.

SEAN: I think that’s a good point. And I love that you just used the phrase “tits up”. When do you get to use that phrase? Not at work!

CHRIS: You gotta make the effort to work it in. I wanted to make an observation on the finger going up the guy’s ear. Where did the other four fingers go?

JB: Well, we’ve got two ear holes, two nose holes…

CHRIS: All five fingers came off and we saw one go in his ear.

JB: He better wash his hands afterwards.

SEAN: Well, wait a minute. One…two…three…four…oh, yeah, he better wash his hands. Especially with the Coronavirus.

JB: Okay, I still don’t know what’s up with Yaz.

SEAN: Neither do I.

CHRIS: No one does.

JB: So we have this expanded flashback where she apparently ran away from home.

SEAN: Oh, yeah. That was nice.

JB: But why? Because she can’t stand her family?

SEAN: Yeah. I am willing to bet … having dated several people outside my race - Asian people - I can’t see that her family would approve of … maybe not her lifestyle but of choosing to be a cop. Just the kinda person that she is, she’s not a subservient…

JB: She’s not a traditionalist.

SEAN: She’s not a traditionalist.

CHRIS: She’s not heavily conservative, either. She doesn’t have the typical cop personality.

JB: And she only became a cop because it was that woman cop that helped her out.

SEAN: Absolutely yes.

JB: So she wanted to emulate her, so she became a cop. And I think it was probably for the wrong reasons. I don’t think she’s cop material.

CHRIS: No, but in defense to that, if more cops were like Yaz, I think it’d be a better world. But they’e not. She doesn’t really fit the mentality. She’s very inclusive and very forgiving. Very reluctant to use violence.

SEAN: We can go on throughout this whole podcast about it. I had someone on Facebook unfriend me over my point of view about cops.

CHRIS: Same.

SEAN: Even though my personal interaction with them has been fine. I’m a white guy that drove ten miles over the speed limit and once got arrested for public intoxication.


SEAN: That was almost 20 years ago. It’s a Class C misdemeanor in the state of Texas. Okay, I’ll tell the story. We got arrested for public intoxication. My boyfriend and I … it was like one o’clock in the morning, and we were going to the car from the bar. We wanted to take down a sign for some sort of street fair that was going on. So a cop arrested us. He body-slammed me onto the ground…

JB: Holy fuck!

CHRIS: WHOA! Over a fucking sign?

SEAN: Yeah. It was a sign that said “No Pets Allowed”, and we were like “oh, we can’t bring our bunnies there!” We didn’t have cats at the time. So this cop body-slammed me face down on the ground and we go to jail. And jail was just a waiting room with a couple of TVs, access to bathrooms and just a bunch of chairs. Women on one side and men on the other side. And it’s five o’clock in the morning, and my boyfriend turns to me and says, “This is really disappointing. This is not like when The Golden Girls were arrested.” No hookers. No bars. It was BORING!

CHRIS: My story of how I got there involved traffic violations, and I was not slammed into the concrete. It was not nearly as interesting as your story, but I spent five hours in jail once for driving under a suspended license. And I didn’t even know it was suspended, and as it turned out it shouldn’t have been suspended. I had the same reaction from being in jail for five hours. I’m sitting there thinking, “No one’s tried to shank me. I haven’t been raped. Actually no one’s fucking talking to me. This is really fucking boring!” It was in a concrete room built with cinder blocks. There was a shitter in there that no one would go near, and there were a couple of benches, and there were no bars. It was like a big plexiglas window and a door. There were two other people. One of them was dead asleep and the other guy was just picking his nose. They did not care that I was there whatsoever.

JB: I feel so left out. I don’t have any jail stories to tell. I almost got arrested for public drinking, but I was able to talk my way out of it. I was drinking with my friend, Doug. It was his 21st birthday. And for some stupid reason we decided to go out and park at the side of a country road. It was the two of us plus my sister and also this girl that both Doug and I were really into. But the two of us were the only ones drinking and were of age. Apparently there was a noise complaint, and a cop came. And I apologized and explained that we were the only ones drinking and my sister was going to drive. I don’t know how we were able to talk our way out of getting arrested!

CHRIS: I think we’ve made this whole episode an editing nightmare for JB.

JB: Nah, this is going to be simple. I’ll chop the start of the recording and the last five minutes. I actually chopped 15 minutes of the last episode because we started talking about who we want to fuck, and no one needs to hear that.

SEAN: I have no memory of that whatsoever.

CHRIS: I don’t either.

SEAN: Wait, JB, who did we want to fuck?

JB: Well, I talked about how I had two sex dreams about Jenna Coleman. I actually had a sex dream last night that I was doing it with the girl who plays Betty on “Riverdale”.

SEAN: Okay, I don’t know that show.

JB: Riverdale. Archie. Betty & Veronica.

SEAN: Oh, yes. I know that now because there’s a Clue game with them on it.

CHRIS: She’s the dark haired one?

JB: No, Betty’s the blonde! Don’t you read comic books?

CHRIS: No, I don’t.

JB: Oh, my god! I thought I was the sheltered one because I was never in jail! You don’t even know which one’s Betty and which one’s Veronica!

(We all collapse into a fit of laughter for about a minute)

SEAN: I think we have to do a regular podcast, now. What was it? “Doctor Who Gives A Fuck”?

CHRIS: Doctor Who Gives A Fuck! Yes!

SEAN: Okay, we’re going to talk about episode blah blah blah, and then talk about own private shit. It would be like a therapy session.

JB: I really enjoyed doing this. So, assuming we survive the coronavirus, or we might be holed up for a few months and not have anything else to do, we might just do this again.

SEAN: It’s very casual. It’s laid back.

JB: I don’t have to do any notes. I like not having to prepare that much.

CHRIS: It’s fun. It’s casual. Not much effort.

SEAN: It’s kinda like sex. Oh, wait, you said “without much effort.” I can’t say that anymore, but whatever.



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